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Corporate Salvation

Query for the Month


December 2017

Next up-date: January 1st 2017 (God willing).

Previous "Queries" are available. Click here to access.


This article is available as a PDF file here.    Or as a WORD doc.

Some perpetual questions ....

Is there really an immortal soul?

Do you know the difference between the "love" that is of Christianity
and the "love" that is of the world?
Click here to find out!

Click on the link for a good book on the character of our God which you can download and share amongst your friends.   It's called "Light through Darkness" and is one of the best books on this subject that I have ever read! 

In the meantime, try this site.   


Here's another great site on the character of God written in a way that's very easy to understand.

In this reply the old-fashioned words of the KJV have been modernised, and in some instances, the man-made punctuation has been altered for greater understanding.  Some of the comments are adapted from books in my library.  No recognition is given because they are not intended as authorities, but are used because they express my understanding clearly.  All the ideas expressed in this article, right or wrong, are my own.   

 The query:

              Does God save in groups?  Is that what corporate salvation is all about?


My response:

There are teachers and members in religious circles who love “their Church” (with a capital “C”) and would like to think that it is “going through to the end” and that they will be saved with it.  But this is not what the Bible teaches.  It speaks of individual salvation only, although group deliverance is certainly written there. 

Why, and what, is the difference?

Why?  Because the group, church, religion, etc. is a picture and not the reality! 

These organisations have their place in the salvation of individuals but are not of God’s making, although they are used by Him as teaching nurseries.  Because of this, there are times when the church must be physically protected, or restored, during and after strong persecutions.

The scriptures are explicit on this point of individuality, although at first it could appear that the whole church will be saved according to texts like the following:

    Romans 11:

25 For I would not, brothers [and sisters], that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. 

26 And so all Israel shall be saved:

as it is written, “There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob”: 27 for this is My covenant to them, when I shall take away their sins. 

But that is not how the original scripture describes it!

    Isaiah 59:

20 And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and to them that turn from transgression in Jacob [that is, in Jacob’s trouble], says the LORD. 

21 As for Me, this is My covenant with them, says the LORD; My Spirit that is upon you, and My words which I have put in your mouth, shall not depart out of your mouth, nor out of the mouth of your seed, nor out of the mouth of your seed's seed, says the LORD, from henceforth and for ever. 

And that is what Paul meant by his previous statement, for he had written earlier in his letter:

    Romans 9:

1 I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost, 2 that I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.  3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brothers [and sisters], my kinsmen according to the flesh: 4 who are Israelites; [the church/nation] to whom pertains the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises; 5 whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever.  Amen.

6 Not as though the word of God has taken none effect. 

For they are not all [spiritual] Israel, which are of [physical] Israel:

7 neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children:

but, “In Isaac shall your seed be called”.  [Genesis 21:12.]

8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not [always] the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. 

So where did the idea of “church” come from, and where is it different? 

Let’s have a look.

As we read, we need to remember that most of this applies only to those who were not genuinely justified, although even the true followers of God felt some of the effects of the group behaviour.  Daniel and his fellows were exiled along with the rest and he classed himself with them. 

    Daniel 9:

4 And I prayed to the LORD my God, and made my confession, and said,

“O LORD, the great and dreadful God, keeping the covenant and mercy to them that love Him, and to them that keep His commandments; 5 we have sinned, and have committed iniquity, and have done wickedly, and have rebelled, even by departing from Your precepts and from Your judgments: 6 neither have we hearkened to Your servants the prophets, which spoke in Your name to our kings, our princes, and our fathers, and to all the people of the land”.

He was not lying, nor foolishly including himself totally with them, for he too had come short of the glory of God in some ways.  However, his sins were not as serious as those of the majority, and God sees degrees of sin.  1 John 5:16-17.

To find out about the “church”, we need to go back to the time when Israel were living as exiles in Babylon and the question was being raised as why He had allowed this to happen to His “nation/church”?

So, using the analogy of a female child, He gave them the picture of the church as He sees it. 

As we read the history we should realise that although the church is easily seen in the world, the wise and foolish (the saved and the unsaved) that are in it are not so readily recognised, for the wise sometimes do bad things and the foolish occasionally do good things.  There are good and bad in every family, but God knows those that are His, as it is written; 

“And the Pharisees also, who were covetous [very selfish], heard all these things: and they derided Him.  And He said to them, ‘You are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knows your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is [often an] abomination in the sight of God’.”  Luke 16:14-15 (and 2 Timothy 2:9).

This message came to the prophet/priest:

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:1-3

Again the word of the LORD came to me, saying, Son of man, cause Jerusalem to know her abominations, and say, Thus says the LORD GOD to Jerusalem; Your birth and your nativity is of the land of Canaan; your father was an Amorite, and your mother a Hittite.

***************(End Quote)

He was saying, “I didn’t conceive you”; and that it was an earthly choice not a heavenly one.  In other words, it was the brainchild of a man, specifically Abraham, who ever since his time has been known as “the father of us all” [meaning, “head of the church’!] although it is written that he was to be the father of many nations and Christ is Head of the church.  Romans 4:16; Genesis 17:4-5; Ephesians 1:22; 5:23; Colossians 1:18.  

So how did this come about?

   {Education 187.2} 

God called Abraham to be a teacher of His word, He chose him to be the father of a great nation [not a church, but that is what men have made of it], because He saw that Abraham would instruct his children and his household in the principles of God's law.  And that which gave power to Abraham's teaching was the influence of his own life [with the Son of God].  His great household consisted of more than a thousand souls, many of them heads of families [mature people], and not a few but newly converted from heathenism.  [They had come from the nations into his family, and it was in this way that he was the “father” to many nations, for they were “naturalised” into his “nation”.]

Such a household required a firm hand at the helm.  No weak, vacillating methods would suffice.  Of Abraham God said, “I know him, that he will command his children and his household after him.” Genesis 18:19.  Yet his authority was exercised with such wisdom and tenderness that hearts were won.  The testimony of the divine Watcher is, “They shall keep the way of the Lord, to do justice and judgment.” Genesis 18:19. 

And Abraham's influence extended beyond his own household.  Wherever he pitched his tent, he set up beside it the altar for [a burnt] sacrifice and worship.  When the tent was removed, the altar remained; and many a roving Canaanite, whose knowledge of God had been gained from the life of Abraham His servant, tarried at that altar to offer sacrifice to Jehovah. 

{Conflict and Courage 49.2} 

In God's sight, a man is just what he is in his family.  The life of Abraham, the friend of God, was signalized by a strict regard for the word of the Lord.  He cultivated home religion.  The fear of God pervaded his household.

He was the priest of his home.  He looked upon his family as a sacred trust.  His household numbered more than a thousand souls, and he directed them all, parents and children, to the divine Sovereign.  He suffered [allowed] no parental oppression on the one hand or filial [family] disobedience on the other.  By the combined influence of love and justice, he ruled his household in the fear of God, and the Lord bore witness to his faithfulness. 

{PP 169.3-4} 

The heritage that God has promised to His people is not in this world.  Abraham had no possession in the earth, “no, not so much as to set his foot on.” Acts 7:5.  He possessed great substance, and he used it to the glory of God and the good of his fellow men; but he did not look upon this world as his home.  [For nations will pass away.  Consider Daniel 7:14.]  The Lord had called him to leave his idolatrous countrymen, with the [apparent] promise of the land of Canaan as an everlasting possession; yet neither he nor his son nor his son's son received it.  When Abraham desired a burial place for his dead, he had to buy it of the Canaanites.  His sole possession in the Land of Promise was that rock-hewn tomb in the cave of Machpelah.  {PP 169.3} 

But the word of God had not failed; neither did it meet its final accomplishment in the occupation of Canaan by the Jewish people. 

“To Abraham and his seed were the promises made.” Galatians 3:16.  Abraham himself was to share the inheritance.  The fulfillment of God's promise may seem to be long delayed -- for “one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day” (2 Peter 3:8); it may appear to tarry; but at the appointed time “it will surely come, it will not tarry.” Habakkuk 2:3. 

The gift to Abraham and his seed included not merely the land of Canaan, but the whole earth.  So says the apostle, “The promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.” Romans 4:13. 

And the Bible plainly teaches that the promises made to Abraham are to be fulfilled through Christ.  All that are Christ's are “Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise” -- heirs to “an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away” -- the earth freed from the curse of sin.  Galatians 3:29; 1 Peter 1:4.  For “the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the Most High;” and “the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.” Daniel 7:27; Psalm 37:11.  {PP 169.4}

God’s true family/church keeps His commandments and has the same faith of/as Jesus.  (Romans 3:22; Revelation 14:12.)

Then the Son of God describes for us the way in which the church came into existence.

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:4-5

And as for your nativity, in the day you were born your navel was not cut, neither were you washed in water to supple you; you were not salted at all, nor swaddled at all.  No eye pitied you, to do any of these to you, to have compassion upon you; but you were cast out in the open field, to the loathing of your person, in the day that you were born. 

***************(End Quote)

The Son of God is saying that the circumstances of the “birth” of the church were desperate, for there were many that opposed it. 

But someone must have pleaded with Him for its existence as Abraham pleaded for Ishmael’s survival, not realising what a terror he would unleash on the world in that desire. 

It is written of Ishmael’s descendants, the Islam of today,

    Revelation 9:11.

“And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is “Abaddon”, but in the Greek tongue has his name “Apollyon”. [Both mean “the destroyer” whom we know as Satan.]

But God granted that yearning for a church as He does many other desires, because we have to find out where our demands lead us.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:6

And when I passed by you, and saw you polluted in your own blood, I said to you when you were in your blood, “Live”; yes, I said to you when you were in your blood, “Live”.

***************(End Quote)

This tells us that He found her naked and alone and couldn’t bear it when He was pleaded with (really He had to allow the father to have his own way), so He stepped up and took her under His wing, as He did so much later with their king.  (See 1 Samuel 8:6-7.)

So what happened?

Abraham's household at his departure from Haran consisted of many souls.  He could raise 318 mature men as trained soldiers when he needed to rescue Lot, and there were many aged, and women and children as well. Genesis 14:14. Those who were led by his teachings to worship the one true God found a home in his encampment; and here, as in a school, they received such instruction as would prepare them to be representatives of the true faith.  Thus a great responsibility rested upon him.  He was training heads of families, and his methods of government would be carried out in the households over which they should preside.  He was preparing them to live in heavenly places. 

But they didn't look out into the world as they should have done! See Acts 1:8.

Instead, they began to look at the picture instead of the reality.

In early times the father was the ruler and priest of his own family, and he exercised authority over his children, even after they had families of their own. Therefore Abraham's spiritual “descendants” were also taught to look up to him as their head, in both religious and secular matters.  This patriarchal system of government Abraham endeavoured to perpetuate because it tended to preserve the knowledge of God. 

It was a wise arrangement, which God Himself had made in the beginning, to cut off His people, so far as possible, from connection with the heathen who would become politically-minded, thus making them a people dwelling alone, and not reckoned among the nations.

It is written;

    Numbers 23:9.

“For from the top of the rocks I see him, and from the hills I behold him [Israel]: lo, the people shall dwell alone, and shall not be reckoned among the nations”. 

    Genesis 12:1-2.

Now the LORD had said to Abram, “Get you out of your country, and from your kindred, and from your father's house, to a land that I will show you: and I will make of you a great nation, and I will bless you, and make your name great; and you shall be a blessing: 

But then it was taken too far!  

God had physically separated Abraham from his idolatrous kindred so that the patriarch might train and educate his “family” apart from the seductive influences which would have surrounded them in Mesopotamia, for God sees His “family/nation” as corresponding to Satan’s “nations” (in them but not of them).  Then Abraham was to send the members out to educate others that the true faith might be preserved in its purity by his “descendants” from generation to generation.

However, because Abraham thought it was necessary to bind the members of the household together in order to build up a barrier against the idolatry of politics that had become so widespread and so deep-seated, he sought by every means in his power to guard the inmates of his encampment against mingling with the heathen and witnessing their idolatrous practices, for he believed that familiarity with evil would insensibly corrupt their principles.  (This is a practice still indulged in by some religious leaders.) Therefore the greatest care was exercised to shut out every form of false religion and to impress the mind with the majesty and glory of the living God as the true object of worship.

Again, in this he went too far.  God will guard His own children from error by teaching them the truth as far as He is allowed, so this part of our education should mainly be left to Him.  (See John 16:13.)  We may tell them about it, but He guards them!

However, Abraham's affection for his children and his household led him to guard their religious faith himself, to impart to them a knowledge of the divine statutes as the most precious legacy he could transmit to them, and through them to the world.   Thus all were taught that they were under the rule of the God of heaven, and also the 'church'.

Ideally, he taught that there was to be no oppression on the part of parents and no disobedience on the part of children, as there should be none in the church. God's law of family relationships had appointed to each his or her duties, and only in obedience to it could any secure happiness or prosperity.  But because of man’s fallen nature, this was soon corrupted by the tares in the family.

The first he was authorized to do, but not the other.

But the Son of God worked with what He was given, so He says:

**************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:7

I have caused you to multiply as the bud of the field, and you have increased and waxed great, and you are come to excellent ornaments [you are attractive]: your breasts are fashioned, and your hair is grown, whereas you were naked and bare.

***************(End Quote)

So God then watched the church/family/nation grow and it became beautiful and useful in His eyes, so He arranged an exodus from Egypt for it.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:8

Now when I passed by you, and looked upon you, behold, your time was the time of love; and I spread My skirt over you, and covered your nakedness.  Yes, I swore to you, and entered into a covenant with you, says the LORD GOD, and you became Mine.

***************(End Quote) 

Then He made a proposal of marriage (a closer union) and through Moses they accepted, but it soon became what we call the first covenant, for the people thought that they could keep the commandments in their own strength.  Deuteronomy 28:13.

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:9-11

Then washed I you with water [in the Red Sea, 1 Corinthians 10:1-4]; yes, I thoroughly washed away your blood from you, and I anointed you with oil. 

I clothed you also with embroidered work, and shod you with badgers' skin, and I girded you about with fine linen, and I covered you with silk.  I decked you also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon your hands, and a chain on your neck.  And I put a jewel on your forehead, and earrings in your ears, and a beautiful crown upon your head.

***************(End Quote)

So, according to the customs of the time, they were anointed for the marriage, and the earthly sanctuary and its services were established as a dowry.  Why did He do that?  Because they had asked for one like the Egyptian temples!! 

They had even converted an ordinary tent into a temporary place of worship before God gave them permission to do so!  In modern terms that means that they were now sleeping in separate beds!

Which is why He said;

    Exodus 25:8    

And let [allow] them make Me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.  

But this lead to the closing their minds when they were not near Him.

After the incident with the golden calf, we are told;

    Exodus 33:7    

And Moses took the tabernacle, and pitched it without [outside] the camp, afar off from the camp, and called it the Tabernacle of the Congregation.  And it came to pass, that every one which sought the LORD went out to the Tabernacle of the Congregation, which was without the camp.  

    {ST, June 3, 1880 par. 2-3}

And Moses pitched the tabernacle without the camp, and all who desired to seek the Lord were commanded to separate themselves from the congregation by resorting thither.  The tabernacle here mentioned was a temporary tent arranged for the worship of God. The sanctuary, the pattern of which God gave to Moses, had not yet been built.   

Here the LORD God stressed His separation from them, a fact that was their choice and not His!  But for Him this was better than nothing!

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:13

Thus were you decked with gold and silver; and your raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and embroidered work; you ate fine flour, and honey, and oil: and you were exceeding beautiful, and you prospered into a kingdom.

***************(End Quote)

Married life with them was great for a while despite the separation, for they spread the gospel as never before although there was a lot of internal strife as well, because they rejected His offer to clear the land for them and tried to conquer Canaan by force, which they sometimes used against each other. 

But after a time they wanted a physical king instead of Him and then David and Solomon came along and the first temple was built.  In this they were trying to make disciples (children) without Him!

But the Son of God was still able to use them:

***************( Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:14

And your renown went forth among the heathen for your beauty: for it was perfect through My comeliness [righteousness], which I had put upon you, says the LORD GOD [Jesus].

***************(End Quote)

Those in the world now knew that the Hebrews were subjects of the living God and some began to look to Him.  Even the queen of Sheba came to visit and enquire, but was beguiled by the earthly splendour of the kingdom.

    1 Kings 10:

6 And she said to the king, “It was a true report that I heard in my own land of your acts and of your wisdom. 7 Howbeit I believed not the words, until I came, and my eyes had seen it: and, behold, the half was not told me: your wisdom and prosperity exceeds the fame which I heard. 8 Happy are your men, happy are these your servants, which stand continually before you, and that hear your wisdom. 9 Blessed be the LORD your God, which delighted in you, to set you on the throne of Israel: because the LORD loved Israel for ever, therefore made He you king, to do judgment and justice”.  

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:15-16

But [like Lucifer] you trusted in your own beauty, and played the harlot because of your renown, and poured out your fornications on every one that passed by; his it was.  And of your garments you took, and decked your high places with divers colours, and played the harlot thereupon: the like things shall not come [again], neither shall it be so [with you, for the end for you is nigh].

***************(End Quote)

But a problem arose when they walked in the footsteps of their original spiritual ancestor, Lucifer (John 8:44), even though God pleaded as only a Husband can do.  The independence movement led to the separation of north and south, Israel and Judah, just as Lucifer and his companions had walked out of heaven after the war of words.  (Jude 1:6.)  Now a “divorce” was looming!  Not from God’s side, but by their choice.

But first, the lovers:

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:17-18

You have also taken your fair jewels of My gold and of My silver, which I had given you, and made to yourself images of men, and did commit whoredom with them, and took your embroidered garments, and covered them: and you have set My oil and My incense before them.

***************(End Quote)

They gave away God’s gifts as bribes to the nations, but that didn’t stop the Assyrians from taking over the ten tribes of the north and re-settling the land with the Samaritans, and many nations began to attack Judah.  So they tried another way to gain their affection.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:19

My meat [food] also which I gave you, fine flour, and oil, and honey, wherewith I fed you, you have even set it before them for a sweet savour: and thus it was [it’s a fact], says the LORD GOD.

***************(End Quote)

Then Judah gave away God’s food (that is, His doctrines) but they were not appreciated by those who were presented with them.  They wanted spicier delights – delights that tickled their minds every week or so – new ideas and doctrines, as so many still want today. 

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:20-21

Moreover you have taken your sons and your daughters, whom you have borne to Me, and these have you sacrificed to them to be devoured.  Is this of your whoredoms a small matter, that you have slain My children, and delivered them to cause them to pass through the fire for them?

***************(End Quote)

So then they gave away God’s children, God’s converts, into the Babylonian captivity, and made them like themselves by teaching a false doctrine of salvation through the church.  (See Matthew 23:15.)   It is now that we can begin to see an organised difference between teachers and students in the “CHURCH”, for religion had become a vocation for a select few and the “Nicolaitanes” were in full swing.  Revelation 2:6, 15.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:22

And in all your abominations and your whoredoms you have not remembered the days of your youth, when you were naked and bare, and were polluted in your blood.

***************(End Quote)

They had forgotten how He had adopted them, and what their background of simplicity had been which is why we are told, “We have nothing to fear for the future, except as we shall forget the way the Lord has led us, and His teaching in our past history”. {Life Sketches 196.2} 

This was reflected in Daniel’s prayer.

   Daniel 9:

7 O LORD, righteousness belongs to You, but to us confusion of faces, as at this day; to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to all Israel, that are near, and that are far off, through all the countries whither You have driven them, because of their trespass that they have trespassed against You. 8 O LORD, to us belongs confusion of face, to our kings, to our princes, and to our fathers, because we have sinned against You.

9 To the LORD our God belong mercies and forgivenesses, though we have rebelled against Him . . .   

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:23-25

And it came to pass after all your wickedness, (woe, woe to you [two special occasions!  596BC and 70AD] says the Lord GOD;) that you have also built to you an eminent place [the temple], and have made you a high place [of pride] in every street.  You have built your high place at every head of the way, and have made your beauty to be abhorred [by Me], and [yet] have opened your feet to every one that passed by, and multiplied your whoredoms.

***************(End Quote)

Then they joined other religions and became proud of their place among them and committed spiritual adultery with them.  This word should settle forever the misperception over the initial “fall” into sin, which confusion many embrace. Whether it was Adam and Eve in the garden, the people of Jerusalem at this time, or any Christian at any time - no one “falls” - we all “jump” at the opportunity and accept the temptation BECAUSE WE WANT TO.  (Of course, later we may hate ourselves for the helplessness that follows, but that is NOT the first reaction to sin.)

Our Saviour pleads with us not to “jump” and shows us a “way of escape”, therefore each and every follower of His has to refuse to be saved in order to sin.

    1 Corinthians 10:13-14

“There has no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that you are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that you may be able to bear it. Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry [which is self-love]”.

Of course, as time goes on and we continue to neglect the warnings, the way of escape becomes harder to see or hear, not because the Spirit unilaterally lets up but because we no longer want to hear and He will not force His presence where it is not wanted.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:26

You have also committed fornication with the Egyptians your neighbours, great of flesh [a mighty nation]; and have increased your whoredoms, to provoke Me to anger.

***************(End Quote)

They joined the world as well, by adopting many of their standards and ways, as they did later with the Greeks when they became Hellenised, and the Romans when they became servile followers of the fashions, and God comments on this. 

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:27-29

Behold, therefore I have stretched out My hand over you, and have diminished your ordinary food, and delivered you to the will of them that hate you, the daughters of the Philistines [the secular group], which are ashamed of your lewd way. You have played the whore also with the Assyrians [again, a secular group], because you were unsatiable [insatiable, limitless]; yes, you have played the harlot with them, and yet could not be satisfied. 

You have moreover multiplied your fornication in the land of Canaan to Chaldea [the religious group]; and yet you were not satisfied therewith.

***************(End Quote)

But they knew that both the religions and states of the world despised them in their hearts, so they became even more desperate, for they wanted the love of the world. 

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:30-32

How weak is your heart [towards Me], says the Lord GOD, seeing you do all these things, the work of an imperious [domineering] whorish woman [Matthew 15:19-20]; in that you build your eminent place in the head of every way, and make your high place in every street; and have not been as a harlot, in that you scorn hire;

but [are] as a wife that commits adultery, which takes strangers instead of her husband!

***************(End Quote)

They were worse than prostitutes in that they didn’t do it for money.  They did it to gain the attention and approval of the nations!  They did it in the place of true love thinking it was OK!

Remember, this applies only to those who were not genuinely justified yet claim a position in the church, although even the followers of God felt some of the effects of the group behaviour.  Daniel and his fellows and others like them, were exiled along with the apostates and yet classed themselves with them. 

The Son of God continues:

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:33-34

They [the customers, normally] give gifts to all whores: but you give your gifts to all your lovers, and hire them, that they may come to you on every side for your whoredom.  And the contrary [behaviour] is in you from other women in your whoredoms, whereas none follows [or persuades] you to commit whoredoms: and in that you give a reward, and no reward is given to you, therefore you are contrary.

***************(End Quote)

They were the instigator of these things and paid their “lovers”, which makes them far worse than those who were actual working as prostitutes for a living. They were “slaves” to their passions.  Romans 7:15.  (Consider Hosea chapters 1, 2 and 3 and what Hosea did about it.  He “bought” his wife back as the Son of man did for His.)   

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:35-37

Wherefore, O harlot [wife], hear the word of the LORD: Thus says the LORD GOD; Because your filthiness was poured out [this was the state of the majority], and your nakedness [lack of protection] discovered through your whoredoms with your lovers, and with all the idols of your abominations, and by the blood of your children, which you did give to them;

Behold, therefore I will gather all your lovers, with whom you have taken pleasure, and all them that you have loved, with all them that you have [eventually] hated; I will even gather them round about against you, and will discover [show] your nakedness [or lack of protection] to them, that they may see all your nakedness.

***************(End Quote)

The Son of God was saying that the price they must pay in the sight of the world would be horrendous, but He could not prevent it.  He could only show them His effort on the cross and plead with them to be allowed to look after them.  (Matthew 23:37-38.

From here on Ezekiel’s mind was guided into the future from Calvary although he did not know it, but the dispersion had begun at this point in his prophecy, something mercifully hidden from his sight.  For us this is no longer just a history of the past, but a beginning of the impending events of Christianity.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:38-41

And I will judge you, as women that break wedlock and [who also] shed blood are judged; and I will give you blood in fury and jealousy. 

And I will also give you into their hand, and they shall throw down your eminent place [the second temple], and shall break down your high places: they shall strip you also of your clothes, and shall take your fair jewels, and leave you naked and bare.

They shall also bring up a company against you, and they shall stone you with stones, and thrust you through with their swords.  And they [your ex-lovers] shall burn your houses with fire, and execute judgments upon you in the sight of many women [religions]: and I will cause you to cease from playing the harlot, and you also shall give no hire any more.

***************(End Quote)

Because it was their choice, He would no longer be able protect them and they would have to face the consequences on their own.  This is the law (or principle) of adultery – it eventually hurts.  It came upon the Jews with the Roman onslaught of 70AD and in after years.  For nearly 2,000 years (till 1948) the Jews have been homeless and their responsibilities passed to the Christians. 

But the dispersion was in their best interest!  They had “divorced” Him at Calvary when they shouted “We have no king but Caesar” (John 19:15), and the position of “wife” had been taken over by another and they would be safer out of the limelight. [In relative terms, of course, because some persecution did follow them but now the Spirit had to work from the outside.] 

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:42-43

So will I make My fury [or lack of protection] toward you to rest [calm down], and My jealousy shall depart from you, and I will be quiet, and will be no more angry.  Because you have not remembered the days of your youth, but have fretted [or agitated] Me in all these things; behold, therefore I also will recompense your way upon your head, says the Lord GOD: and you shall not [continue to] commit this lewdness above all your abominations.

***************(End Quote)

But He would still call to those of them who remained in their original state and some of them would come back to Him through the church, which men now called “Christianity”, the “daughter” of Abraham’s “child”.  Others would choose to wait until the first resurrection.

But of Christianity He also sadly says:

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:44

Behold, every one that uses proverbs shall use this proverb against you, saying,

                             “As is the mother, so is her daughter”.

You are your mother's daughter that loathes her husband and her children [your appointed place in the family]; and you are the sister of your sisters, which loathed their husbands and their children: your mother was a Hittite, and your father an Amorite. [So He had not fathered the new branch of the church either!]

***************(End Quote)

Their breeding showed in their behaviour, but the professed Christians were worse in that they were His new wife and could have done so much better.

Therefore it is written:

    Revelation 2:1-4.

“To the angel [the person in charge] of the church of Ephesus [the symbol of the church from 31AD to 100AD] write; These things says He that holds the seven stars in His right hand, who walks in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;  . . . I have somewhat against you, because you have left your first love”.   

This carried on until He had to say:

    Revelation 3:17-19, 16.

Because you say, “I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing”; and know not [refuse to believe] that you are wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: I counsel you to buy of Me gold tried in the fire [faith that has been tested], that you may be rich; and white raiment [the wedding garment], that you may be clothed, and that the shame of your nakedness do not appear; and anoint your eyes with eyesalve [the Holy Spirit], that you may see.  As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent [don’t leave Me!] . . .

So then because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will [have to] spue you out of My mouth [I must let you go]

Now there came a change of relationships:

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:46

And your elder sister is Samaria [the religious ones], she and her daughters that dwell at your left hand: and your younger sister that dwells at your right hand, is Sodom [the political ones] and her daughters. 

***************(End Quote)

All religions and nations are part of Satan’s evil family, but not all are as bad as the others, for there are degrees of sin. 

But, speaking to the professed Christian churches, God says;

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:47-48

Yet have you not [just] walked after their ways, nor done after their abominations, but, as if that were a very little thing, you were corrupted more than they in all your ways.  As I live, says the Lord GOD, Sodom your sister has not done, she nor her daughters, as you have done, you and your daughters.

***************(End Quote) 

But they were the worst of the brood!  They claimed the birthright, but refused the power to hold it.

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:49-50

Behold, this was the iniquity of your sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.  And they were haughty, and committed abomination before Me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.

***************(End Quote)

Speaking of the nations, God says that one section of the world’s population would perish because of pride and satisfaction in its knowledge, and lack of compassion.  The other “sister” did the same, but with a different emphasis.

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:51

Neither has Samaria [the religions] committed half of your sins; but you have multiplied your abominations more than they, and have justified your sisters in all your abominations which you have done.

***************(End Quote)

The so-called Christian denominations joined the false religions and the nations and God says that they would all perish because of their rejection of knowledge.  But the Christians professed to be His “wife” and in this they became the worst!

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:52

You also, which have judged [condemned] your sisters, bear your own shame for your sins that you have committed [which are] more abominable than they: they are more righteous than you: yes, be you confounded also, and bear your shame, in that you have justified your sisters.

***************(End Quote)

But God’s “wife” had done more bad things than those she condemned, and in so doing had made her “sisters” look better to God and the people of the universe.  (We should remember, this applies only to those who were not genuinely justified, although even the followers of God felt some of the effects of the group behaviour.  Daniel and his fellows were exiled along with the rest and as we have seen, he classed himself with them, just as Moses classed himself with the rebellious Hebrews.  Exodus 32:32.) 

But a time of retribution was coming:

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:53-54

When I shall bring again their captives [from the grave], the captivity of Sodom and her daughters [the worldly ones], and the captivity of Samaria and her daughters [the religious groups], then will I bring again the captivity of your captives in the midst of them: that you may bear your own shame, and may be confounded in all that you have done, in that you are a comfort to them [because you are worse than them!] 

***************(End Quote)

There will be a day of reckoning at the end of the 1,000 years and the sisters will have an easier time than the wife will, even though they haven’t repented.

So the Son of God says:

***************(Begin Quote)

Ezekiel 16:55-57

When your sisters, Sodom and her daughters, shall return to their former estate, and Samaria and her daughters shall return to their former estate [come alive in the second resurrection], then you and your daughters shall return to your former estate [with them]

For your sister Sodom was not mentioned by your mouth in the day of your pride, before your wickedness was discovered, as at the time of your reproach of the daughters of Syria, and all that are round about her, the daughters of the Philistines, which despise you round about.

***************(End Quote)

They will all be treated the same but the results, the length of time they must spend in the Lake of Fire will be different because of their actions and attitudes, not God’s choice.

Then there is to be another change of relationship:

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:58-60

You have [rightly] borne your lewdness and your abominations, says the LORD.  For thus says the Lord GOD; I will even deal with you as you have done, which have despised the oath in breaking the covenant [of marriage to Me]

Nevertheless I will remember My covenant with [some of] you in the days of your youth, and I will establish to you an everlasting covenant.

***************(End Quote)

Only after the cross comes the crown.  And so, all spiritual Israel shall be saved. (Remember, this applies only to those who were genuinely justified, although even they have felt some of the effects of the group behaviour as well as their own.)

God is now speaking to the redeemed from the church:

***************(Begin Quote) 

Ezekiel 16:61

Then you shall remember your ways, and be ashamed, when you shall receive your [repentant] sisters, your elder and your younger: and I will give them to you for daughters, but not by your covenant [not in your way].

***************(End Quote)

We should note this point with care: like Jacob, the middle sister will receive the spiritual birthright of the firstborn, the “double portion”, while all of them will receive the adoption and become equal “sisters”.  (Genesis 25:29-34; Deuteronomy 21:17.)

That’s why this is written:

    Revelation 15:

4 Who shall not fear [respect] You, O LORD, and glorify Your name [character]? For You only are holy: for all nations shall come and worship before You; for Your judgments are [now] made manifest . . .  

    Revelation 21:

10 And he carried me away in the Spirit [in a vision] to a great and high mountain, and showed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God .  .  . 24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth [which are saved] do bring their glory and honour into it. 25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. 26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it .  .  .   

    Revelation 22:

2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the Tree of Life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the [spiritual] healing of the nations [bringing them up to speed in the doctrines and character of God].  

***************(Begin Quote)   

Ezekiel 16:62

And I will establish My covenant with you; and you shall know that I am the LORD: that you may remember, and be confounded, and never open your mouth any more because of your shame, when I am pacified toward you for all that you have done, says the Lord GOD.

***************(End Quote)

There will be a time of contrition (principally the “time of Jacob’s trouble”, and then during the 1,000 years to finish off the Day of Atonement) and after that:-

“What do you imagine against the LORD?  He will make an utter end: affliction shall not rise up the second time”.  Nahum 1:9.


So why do we have so many different religions which are not of God’s family?  Because Satan soon realised that he could control men’s minds easier through religion than he could through the state, and so he set up his masterpiece church, called “Babylon” in the Bible, in opposition to the believer’s one, and from it produced “daughters”.  (See Revelation 17:5.)   

But the basic truth is that men like to teach that God saves corporately (or nationally) because they are not saved personally.



Who wants to add (or subtract!) from these thoughts? I won't argue as I have stated, but I will publish your Scriptures so that we may review all the words of God on the subject.


Next query.            To be discussed from January 1st 2017.

Why do the events of Revelation chapter 11 appear to come (in history) BEFORE the events of chapter 10 in which we are told that we must give the cry AGAIN?   In a normally progressive prophetic message this is surely unusual.

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